Dear Sir,

As a fully qualified teacher of children aged from four to six I wanted to write to compare my experiences with recent events surrounding the Evening News and Star and Carlisle United. I see so many parallels between your petty arguments and those between the children in my school. These arguments are not winning you any friends. The general opinions I am hearing from other fans based in Cumbria are that they are sick of it. The response I expect from this letter is one along the lines of "Well they started it". Prove me wrong and try to call a truce. You are after all working against some of the biggest egos in football. Allowing them to "win" could benefit all of us.

Andy Munnings, Petersfield, Hants

Al's note : I hope you also wrote to the club with similar views. The 'spat' is not helping the club's image and confirms the worst held fears of many. From what I gather the newspaper have tried to call a truce but Mr Collins is not speaking to them under any circumstances. It's up to the club to lift the ban. We have a free press in this country and they should be able to report on the club using whatever angle they feel is appropriate.

Sun, 7 Oct 2001 11:25:44 +0100 (BST)

club or country?

was there any choice for us diehard proud carlisle fans on saterday?

no choice at all,club will always come first to us.the fans who turned up at brunton park are a credit to there clubs.

a well deserved three points for a outstanding performance.

king beckhams goal was a corker but stevie hallidays goal gave me the biggest cheer of the day.up the blues!.

Dave Airey, Carlisle

Al's note : I find myself celebrating Carlisle's goals with about as much enthusiasm as someone heading for the dentist's chair. It's hard to put off-field events out of your mind, however much you want the Cumbrians to win.

Sun, 30 Sep 2001 11:49:41 +0100 (BST)

Having supported Carlisle for 20 years plus, I along with many others I would guess are at the point of despair. The last trhree years have been an absolute disaster in footballing and financial terms and this season does not look promising as the Conference door seems to be welcoming us in already. Last season we were saved by our good defencive record but Mr Collins seems determmined to get rid of any one who played under Ian Atkins which includes some very good defenders. We seem to concede too many goals from set pieces and appear totally incapable of holding on to a lead (the exception being against York City).

Whoever is in charge of Carlisle at the moment needs to take radical steps to ensure that the club is sold to respectable people, get some money injected quickly and ensure that we start to move up the table and get back where we belong. If that is with Roddy Collins so be it, if not then let's get some-one who actually cares about the club and give them a long term contract so that we don't change the manager every season which can't help our cause.

Please spare us the agonies of the last three years and start building for the future.

Tim Vigeon, Middlesex

Al's note : It is worrying that Collins seems so hell-bent on the destruction of a squad that last season, appeared to have turned the corner and was getting stronger by the end. Every man has his own way of playing, but at the moment we appear unable to hold teams and our passing game is often getting bypassed. At Hartlepool we had so little of the ball, it didn't matter how well we could pass it!

Thu, 27 Sep 2001 00:55:51 +0100 (BST)

I HEARD THAT RODDY COLLINS WAS INTERESTED IN AN IRISH KID,WELL THERE IS A KID PLAYING FOR MONAGHAN IN THE IRISH PREMIER,CALLED PAUL SHIELS ,WHO WOULD REALLY FIT THE BILL.HE IS HAVING A GREAT SEASON AND IS A REALLY TOUGH PLAYER.HE WOULD SUIT THE 3RD DIVISION.I DONT KNOW IF THIS CAN GET TO RODDY BUT IF POSSIBLE HE SHOULD HAVE A LOOK.

Darren Smyth, Florida, USA

Al's note : I think Yer Man's interested in more than just one Irish kid! I also expect he's aware of Shiels.

Tue, 18 Sep 2001 22:49:13 +0100 (BST)

Being a CUFC supporter now for over 50 years, the majority of these having been in "exile" either in The far East or now in the Midlands, do I detect a recent refreshing upturn in the administration at the official Carlisle United website (www.carlisleunited.co.uk)?

The site is now extremely informative and modern having video clips of the goals of the recent match as well as a live linked commentary provided by the Radio Cumbria. The latter is a real boon to me as I am now able to participate (albeit cyber-style) from a distance in the atmosphere of the match such as I used to enjoy in my old seat in the 'C' stand.

I am not sure just who at the Club is behind this "communications revolution" and responsible for the development of the website but I for one feel that credit should be given to the person or persons there who have obviously put in some hard work thus enabling supporters in exile such as myself at last to have even more compelling reasons for eagerly looking forward to the match-days.

Keep up the good work.

P.S. Am pleased to have penned this without feeling the need to make any reference to Mr. Blobby!!

David Hall, Halesowen, West Midlands

Al's note : The man to blame, sorry congratulate is Phil Holmes. I expect no-one else wanted the job - it is a thankless task. The site is much better but still gets used by certain people to attack anything and everything that might appear in the local media about the club. There are bound to be 'negative' articles when the club has had so much go wrong with it in the recent past. And the commentary feature was provided by my site last year so I hope you were able to sample it on here first!

Sun, 16 Sep 2001 11:16:06 +0100 (BST)

Only seven league games into the season and fans are calling for roddy collins head for the chopping block. give the man a chance.

alot of the football i have seen so far this season is the best i have seen for years from a carlisle team.the passing football is a joy to watch. the team out against cheltenham was a depleted one, yet listening to derek lacey"s poor commentary we could of still got a point. give roddy collins a chance to kick out all those not good enough to play for carlisle and get a settled team together,then judge him on results.my prediction is six points from the next two games then everybody will be singing his praises again.

David Airey, Carlisle

Al's note : Seven games is a little early to be drawing such conclusions, although the recent disposal of players seemed a bit alarming. The likes of Stevens and Maddison seemed perfectly capable of playing at this level last season and young Paul Antony seems to have been harshly treated. However if pots of money are suddenly being made available, maybe he is now able to move up a gear in the transfer market, making some of these people he is keen to get rid of expendable.

Sun, 16 Sep 2001 10:40:24 +0100 (BST)

Having expended a lot of time, and not insignifigant amounts of money, to jouney to Cheltenham to witness the total farce that occurred there I wish to make some comment on the state of the club.

Having witnessed the gutless and tatically niave display that Roddy Collins' team put on we seem to have bigger problems than anyone previously thought. How on earth you play the best sweeper in the division in Midfield is beyond me, and the lack of team unity was apparent yesterday, we were playing as 11 men rather than as a team and that is a problem Roddy Collins must adress immediately.

As for the state of affairs of the pitch, no-one seriosly believes Michael Knighton when he says the club will be sold within 6 weeks. I urge all fans to boycott Brunton Park NOW, to force the Knighton regime out before then, and if that includes Roddy Collins so be it; it is not our survival in the Football league that is at state, although without a change we are surely doomed, but the existence of the club itself.

Simon Ash, Gateshead

Al's note : It was a dire show but the lads bounced back quickly against York. Collins now seems to be making further moves to strengthen the squad.

Tue, 11 Sep 2001 10:08:21 +0100 (BST)

How refreshing to read the Sept 1 comments of a fan calling for a more balanced take on events at Brunton Park. The vast majority of supporters have long since accepted that the best course of action for the club would be for Michael Knighton to depart the club for good. Overwhelming evidence suggests that this approach is just. But the constant hysteria, suspicion, and over-elaborate sensationalism surrounding every single turn of events at the club serves little positive purpose. There are some supporters among us who are occasionally inclined to stand up for Knighton and, whilst hardly singing his praises, attempt to balance things out a touch, with a dose of realism.

The most preposterous example of this comes in the form of comments which suggest that Roddy Collins is a 'Michael Knighton plant', as one of your readers recently suggested. How serious such remarks are, we can only guess. The evidence of the early stages of Collins' tenure suggests many positives. Lest we forget that Collins took Bohemians further than they had ever dared dream. The insularity of English football means we never give the Irish league a passing glance. But Collins achieved great things over there, and there are enough facts to back this up. He has also, I believe, acted rather better in the transfer market than his predecessor Ian Atkins, who played the press, and consequentially the supporters, far more shrewdly than his most devout sympathisers would ever admit. It is true that Atkins was severely limited by a transfer embargo and boardroom turbulence. I do not believe Atkins did a bad job, given his resources and circumstances. But, aside from the purchase of Richie Foran, which one must assume was the result of an overdue loosening of the purse strings by Mark Knighton (the Delap and Dobie money must have played some part here), he had much the same to work with as does Collins now. And the standard of player Collins is currently recruiting, be it on loan or on free transfers, is, on current evidence, significantly better. Elliott, Murphy and Haddow are streets ahead of Hemmings, Heggs, Carr and the like. There are early signs that Steve Halliday is feeling comfortable with his football again, which, if true, would be like a new signing. Foran looks to have mountains of potential. He may yet bring the best out of Jonny Allan, who also looks highly promising. And if he can encourage Tony Hopper to make the best of his limited ability but unquestionable heart and drive in a scuffling third division midfield, then the manager will have worked some wonders. He has shown short shrift to the likes of Ian Stevens, a fantastic servant to the club and a truly natural goalscorer, but one whose best years are behind him. So yes, the early signs are good, and are not served by any conspiracy theory or catcalling fan who prefers to abuse Michael Knighton rather than to sit back and look at a wider picture.

By and large, the media, and the News & Star's reporting of all things Carlisle United is thorough, and excellent. But the temptation to pander to the crude and unsubtle opinions of a proportion of its readership is often too tempting to resist. Michael Knighton has lived and died by the media, which we, and he, must accept. But the pandering to Atkins, and the constant vilification of Knighton, has occasionally been imbalanced and unfair. It is of little surprise that their supporters' polls come out overwhelmingly in favour of Atkins when the readers are constantly fed on a pro-Atkins anti-Knighton diet. The purpose such polls serve should be more peripheral than is often the case.

There is other evidence, which no Carlisle fan will forget, to suggest that Mr Knighton has done substantial good for the club. Saving us from extinction is a good start. Taking the club so memorably to Wembley, twice, was unforgettable. Two promotions too. Who knows what may have happened if Wadsworth, who publicly said that his players were good enough to sustain the club in division 2, had not left when he did. We should not forget, but I suspect people may, that Matt Jansen, who may soon play for England, flourished most profoundly when Knighton, Wilkes and Halpin ran the team (the idea that Knighton took training or picked the team is one of the more damaging myths - but the regime, however it was structured, helped nurture one of the most exciting talents in the British game today). Upon relegation to the 3rd division, serious money was invested in players from higher divisions, the Finneys and Brightwells, whose reputations preceded them and were not half the players one initially expected. Nigel Pearson and Martin Wilkinson were disasters, and, while Atkins was better, I for one am glad that the club has appointed a man with a more substantial track record, commands some deal of respect throughout the game (as his new recruits have showed), and who is perpared to give the playing staff the kind of shake-up which not even Atkins could achieve. If this is 'Knighton's plant', then let us give him the time to flourish. As I said, I am not a Knighton supporter and agree that he should go, for much of what he has done, to and for Carlisle United, has been misguided and ill-judged, as history shows. But he is not the devil incarnate. He is a businesman who wishes to get the best return for his investment in the club, an investment with which none of us argued when it was first made.

So yes, Knighton should give more tangible proof of his assertions that the club is soon to be sold. But we must also be true and consistent with our own convictions and principles, and occasionally attempt to resist the power of a strong media, and a weight of public opinion which, hard though it may be to accept, is occasionally misguided.

Jon Colman, Lancaster

Al's note : You make a lot of valid points here, but I think you are a little harsh on Atkins. He was never given anything like £50,000 to spend on a striker of Foran's quality and the financial support for him was virtually non-existent until January of this year. He certainly wasn't afraid to make changes, and had to start off, in case it's slipped your memory, with only six pros on the books, unlike Collins. Equally, Collins has yet to record a victory and has only had six games in charge up to now - a little premature to be making comparisons. His track record is no more substantial than that of Atkins. Granted he won the double with Bohemians, and that was a great achievement but he had no experience in English league football prior to coming here. Atkins had already guided Northampton from near the bottom of Division 3 to the 2nd Division play-offs, as well as almost pulling off a miracle escape act with Chester. To give Knighton any credit at all for the development of Jansen is bizarre. David Wilkes should get the lion's share - Jansen was working with him long before Knighton's misguided move into the manager's chair. To cap it all, Knighton sold Jansen to Crystal Palace in the middle of a relegation battle that Carlisle eventually lost partly as a result of his transfer.

Mon, 10 Sep 2001 21:13:50 +0100 (BST)

Oh dear, I must be getting cynical. Knighton states that a sale is imminent just before the Sports Minister is about to bring up the subject of Carlisle United with the Football League.

The words 'Knighton' and 'promises' go together like 'politician' and 'honest'.

He said last week that the situation would be resolved by October. In the light of the loan taken out on the ground and the sudden splurging of money on Foran ( Dobie- supposedly worth two million so sell him for £150,000 then spend £100,000 on a player who might well spend most of the season suspended) is Knighton's definition of resolved going to be declaring the club bankrupt so he finally gets his hands on the ground?

Just in case this is more Knighton dissimulation and he's going for yet another season of trying to get us to finish bottom, can the News and Star PLEASE try and get somebody at Brunton Park to confirm that all transfers are being rigorously checked so that Knighton can't do a Chesterfield on us and get us docked 9 points!

Denis Robinson, Carlisle

Al's note : You are right of course. Nobody should believe a deal is done until the ink is dry on the contract and Knighton has walked off into the sunset for the final time.

Mon, 10 Sep 2001 00:32:28 +0100 (BST)

i was at the Darlington game and i was encoraged by what i saw , not only good passing ,most of the time ,but speed in support play and closing down the opposition. The goal that they got was due to us giving the ball away in an area that a good old thump up the other end would of done , however this is where the differance has been made , they are playing passing football most of the time and i for one love it , they will win more games than they lose , on the way out of the ground i walked amongst the Darlington surporters and overheard comments sutch as ,they were the best team (CARLISLE) and , we were lucky to draw, and i had to agree Carlisle were good very good , and i hope the players do not feel to down as i am sure they are on the brink of doing very well this season.

Mr Logan, Wetheral

Al's note : As I have said a bit of patience is required because Collins is trying to pass his way up the league and this can't be done overnight. The signs are there that the players are gaining in confidence with this style of play and hopefully better results are not far off.

Sat, 8 Sep 2001 01:07:48 +0100 (BST)

To the most supporters in Cumbria who have missed the point, that Roddy Collins is another M Knighton plant and that he is out to bollocks the club under instructions, as did Martin Wilkinson, who succeeeded. WHO IS GOING TO STOP THE ROT? Are Carlisle so stupid to not see what that MAN IS DOING. For God's sake wake up!

Alan Bainbridge, Berkeley, Gloucs

Al's note : That's a bit harsh on Collins, although I think he was a bit foolish to get himself sucked into the politics last week. He should stick to talking about football, something he said he would when he first arrived.

Fri, 7 Sep 2001 21:48:05 +0100 (BST)

i do not see why everyone is concerned about carlisle united at the minute. they are just going through a bad patch, i believe that they will rise from this bad patch and do well this season. they will aslo do alot greater if knighton leaves the club! as he must be still pulling the strings behind the club. also the players that carlisle have signed will do well for carlisle i believe i think people should trust in their home club and go and support them! come on you blues!

Tom Twentyman, Carlisle

Al's note : Just a bad patch eh? That's like describing World War II as a minor disturbance. We've spent the last four seasons in the bottom three of our division and have almost been relegated to the Conference on two occasions. We are very much a club in crisis on and off the field.

Wed, 5 Sep 2001 16:59:08 +0100 (BST)

i agree with what derek lacey said. if mr knighton wants too spend money on quality players what is the problem. at the end of the day staying in the league is the most important factor.

myself being a loyal supporter home and away,i cannot believe the poor attendence at brunton park. how can the so called die hard fans bring themselves to stay away. we are one win away from take off, i wonder if we were top of the table now how many would then stay away. remember arsenal last year?

David Airey, Carlisle

Al's note : I'm sure we'd all be delighted to see Mr Knighton embark on a spending spree but it won't happen. For one thing it is not his money that he is spending and secondly, he shouldn't be responsible for such decisions as he is banned by the DTI from acting as a director. This will at least stop him from taking the credit. I personally can't believe the attendances are so high considering we have spent three years at the bottom of the league and we are still there today. Mr Knighton is incredibly lucky to have got away with it for so long - he has survived by virtue of the windfall payments and loyal and as the above example shows, incredibly fickle supporters.

Tue, 4 Sep 2001 13:36:54 +0100 (BST)

SIR,LIVING IN SOUTHERN ENGLAND MEANS MY WIFE AND I ARE MAINLY ARMCHAIR SUPPORTERS,BUT WE WISH EVERYONE INVOLVED WITH CUFC GOOD LUCK FOR THE SEASON,WHICH LOOKS LIKE A DIFFICULT ONE. DOES ANY OF YOUR READERS HAVE A XL SIZE AWAY SHIRT OF 3 SEASONS AGO WHICH I CAN PURCHASE?

Gary Phillips, Salisbury, Wiltshire

Sat, 1 Sep 2001 22:02:58 +0100 (BST)

having been to the game today (v Rochdale) and having listened to the comments of Mr Collins on local radio after the match I find myself concurring with him. Richie Foran is without doubt, providing he maintains his discipline and on the evidence of today I do not see why there should be any problems, going to be the hottest property in the 3rd division. I have been watching lower league football for too many years to remember and on the evidence of today's performance this boy is going to the best I have seen not only at Brunton Park but elsewhere as well. He has an excellent first touch, he is good in the air and his position sense of the ball smacks of player who should be playing at a higher level, his work rate despite his obvious lack of match fitness at this level was superb.

Whilst being critical of the previous actions of the current owners it doesn't take a genius to work out what was behind the bizarre antics at the club over the past few weeks:

a) Ian Atkins was appointed by Doweck and co against the express wishes of the majority share holder.

b) Heggs, Maddison, Halliday were all signed by Atkins.

What better way to twist Atkins's arm to leave the club?

Having achieved his goal the majority shareholder appoints his own man, Collins.

Despite being a relative unknown in this country he, within a few weeks gets the club moving in the right direction. (I know we're at the bottom at the moment but things are on the up).

However, despite this News & Star continue to be totally hung up about the takeover. Unfortunately your reporting now smacks of a personal vendetta with Mr Knighton and not a balanced view of what is best for Carlisle United.

For what its worth I think the club will be sold in the next few months and having a certain amount of inside information I would prepare for an even greater influx of the Irish, which on the basis of the early evidence will be a good thing.

Up the blues!

Anonymous

Al's note : The newspaper's reporting focuses on Michael Knighton as it is he who is holding the club to ransom. What is best for Carlisle United would be for him to sell. He has spoken about doing this for two years now, and he is still making excuses and setting imaginary 'deadlines'. What would you do if you ran the local newspaper, read by thousands of people who are totally fed up with the situation?

Sat, 25 Aug 2001 07:18:28 +0100 (BST)

Why after all this time is Knighton still in control?? Does he not understand we don't want him. Does he not get the point. Why can't he just resign. He is so over powered with control why can't he let the people have a say..he's like a dictator

Amanda Walls, Australia

Al's note : He resigned long ago but let no-one be in any doubt about who is still pulling the strings at Brunton Park. He might be banned as a director, but it's a rule that's virtually impossible to enforce and Knighton knows it.

Mon, 20 Aug 2001 20:23:25 +0100 (BST)

It seems to me that since Roddy Collins has joined Carlisle, players seem to be coming in from everywhere. Collins has now signed five players in a matter of days and looks to exceed that. When Ian Atkins was in charge he took his time over signings and made good use of his loans with quality players. I just hope that the players Roddy has brought in are quality players and that he is not rushing himself into signings. A team like Carlisle needs to get quality players as we have to all admit theres not much quality in the team they have.

Roger Dixon, Keswick

Al's note : I think a lot of people are concerned over the quality of our squad, and that appears to include Roddy himself. He has managed to make a lot of signings very quickly even if all of them so far are short-term in nature. Time will tell which ones are up to scratch. At least with short contracts, you can easily off-load the ones who are no good. However, I'm sure we'd all like to see a return to the days when CUFC are signing players on two and three-year deals with no restrictions from the powers-that-be.

Sun, 19 Aug 2001 03:26:05 +0100 (BST)

I WOULD JUST LIKE TO CAST MY THOUGHTS TOWARDS MERVYN DAY. THINK OF WHAT HE DONE FOR CARLISLE. FOR MERVYN IT ALL STARTED WHEN HE LED CARLISLE TO THE TOP OF DIVISION THREE AND FINALLY DOMINATING THE LEAGUE, BUT FOR MERVYN HIS FORTUNE DID'NT END THERE, HE ALSO PROVED HIS POWERS AS A MANAGER BY LEADING THE CUMBRIANS TO WEMBLEY AND TO ANOTHER OUSTANDING VICTORY FOR CARLISLE. I THINK IF ONLY HE WAS'NT FIRED HE MAY HAVE SAVED CARLISLE FROM THEIR LOSS IN PRIDE LAST SEASON.

James Lowes, Harker, Carlisle

Al's note : Mervyn did a great job at Brunton Park and I know many would love to see him back, but let's not take anything away from Ian Atkins who did all he could in difficult circumstances.

Mon, 13 Aug 2001 16:49:54 +0100 (BST)

As an exiled Cumbrian I felt following Saturday's result v Luton to advise Mr Knighton that the Beds On Sunday headline was: LUTON DOWN "PUB TEAM".

This is the state this once great club has now reached, he must sell before it's to late. Drop out of the league and they will not come back.

Ian Coulson, Biggleswade

Al's note : Describing us as a "pub team" is a little bit harsh I think but you are right in pointing out that the spectre of relegation to non-league football once again hangs over us. It could be the death knell for professional football in Cumbria. We should be doing all we can to preserve that precious status. It can't be taken for granted by anyone.

Sun, 12 Aug 2001 17:34:45 +0100 (BST)

The start of another season and yet another defeat. No change from last year then but after the first half performance against a multi-million squad, the young boys should be proud of themselves. The only problems are lacking in squad depth and creativity. Hopefully the "new owner" can back his manager with new players for consolidation this year and build for next year.

Stuart Oswald, Keswick

Al's note : We do have the nucleus of a useful squad but we appear to be lacking in several key areas. I don't think we need to spend a fortune by any means - but a little more than £10,000 (at £2,000 a season) would help. Rotherham climbed up from Division 3 to Division 1 after spending just £200,000 on their squad. We could and should be capable of that level of spending with an ambitious owner.

Sun, 12 Aug 2001 16:10:59 +0100 (BST)

Does the person who decided to hike the parking fee at Brunton Park by 150% realise how heavily the clubs hopes and ambitions rely on the out of town supporters? Many of us have no alternative but to travel by car .

The cost of parking a car at the Sands Centre is £1 for 3 hours,yet at Brunton Park it is now £2.50 to park in a mud bath for 2 hours. Ticket prices, programmes and parking have all been increased this season. I certainly feel I am being taken for a ride. Come off it Andrea (or whoever) under the present climate,is this the reward for loyalty? Is it any wonder the "Golden Gamble" paid only £144 from a 4,000+ gate?

Brian Nelson, Millom

Al's note : They certainly know how to keep their customers dissatisfied down at Brunton Park, don't they? Is it any wonder fans are ready to boycott?

Mon, 6 Aug 2001 23:12:14 +0100 (BST)

An appeal to all fans.

Don't boycott the home games. Get there in numbers to convince the new players and manager that they have joined a club worth fighting for.

Protest against Knighton by wearing a CCUIST T-shirt to the game or anything else white!

Alan Sinclair, Barry, South Wales

Al's note : A lot of fans chose not to boycott the Luton game in the belief that a takeover was finally going to be completed, me included. We wait with bated breath. I will wear my CCUIST T-shirt but I fear it will take more than that to shift Mr K.

Wed, 1 Aug 2001 13:57:06 +0100 (BST)

I WOULD JUST LIKE TO SAY THAT IN MY OPINION YOU HAVE GOT AN EXCEPTIONAL MANAGER IN RODDY COLLINS. WHAT HE DID AT BOHEMIANS WAS NOTHING SHORT OF REMARKABLE. HE SINGLE HANDEDLY TRANSFORMED AN AVERAGE LOI TEAM INTO LEAGUE AND CUP WINNERS AND A TEAM THAT ALSO KNOCKED OUT ABERDEEN AND WERE VERY UNLUCKY TO LOSE TO KAISERSLAUTERN IN THE UEFA CUP(THEY EVEN WON 1-0 AWAY IN GERMANY). RODDY WAS ABLE TO DO THIS BY HIS MOTIVATIONAL SKILLS AND THE FACT THAT IF YOU DONT PERFORM OR IF YOU DONT GIVE 100% YOU ARE GONE WHOEVER YOU ARE. BOHS LOSS IS CARLISLE'S GAIN. I WISH YOU ALL THE BEST THIS SEASON FROM A SWANSEA CITY SUPPORTER LIVING IN IRELAND.

Paul Browne, Dublin, Ireland

Al's note : He has my best wishes - he'll need them. A lot of fans are baffled by the appointment of an outspoken manager who has a history of clashes with authority. This sounds like a recipe for friction bearing in mind the Ian Atkins saga. But note he has no contract - a dangerous sign!

Fri, 27 Jul 2001 19:28:52 +0100 (BST)

Isn't about time we started talking positively about Carlisle United and not continually look at the bleak side? OK we may not have a huge pool of players but what we do have is a strong core who want to play coupled with a few promising youngsters. If all they are hearing is moaning and groaning from a section of the fans who probably don't attend Brunton Park that often then eventually their confidence will start to be affected and we will lose games.

So come on let's leave the backstabbing for a while let things settle down and stand together and I am sure we will finish at least in mid- table.

E.Dunion, Annan

Al's note : It would be easier to talk positively if there were positive things to talk about. It would be folly to pretend things are ok and just sit back and do nothing. A mid-table finish would be welcomed by all the fans but as things stand, that would seem highly optimistic, frankly.

Thu, 26 Jul 2001 18:28:14 +0100 (BST)

Truthfully I think a boycott is definitely not the right way to go about this disgusting situation. If Carlisle are to survive this catastrophe then i think US.. the fans need to give the players as much support as possible on the pitch. Come on Peter Beardsley, I think that nearly every loyal Carlisle United fan would love to see Peter take over as manager for many reasons. The main reason obviously is because he was a world class player not just domestic but also for England. He is currently managing the Newcastle under 19 squad, so if he came over here to manage, he could bring a few of the youngsters over with him for a few seasons to play until they are guaranteed first team football in Newcastle. Finally I was at the match the other night against Preston, what a goal by Morley, I just hope we see goals like that more often this season. John Hore, magnificent player...the next Richard Prokas.

Michael Denovellis, Lowry Hill, Carlisle

Al's note : The boycott is an action by fans who have been loyal for the past few seasons and now feel the loyalty thing has not achieved anything. As for Beardsley, I can't see him becoming our manager until new owners are in place.

Wed, 25 Jul 2001 12:25:55 +0100 (BST)

After leaving the club at the end of the 99/2000 season its incredible that the club seems to have deteriorated even further. Nothing that happens at Carlisle United can shock me now and it really needs someone to resolve the situation so the club can look forward and plan for the future. It will always produce talented players and couple that with some quality and experienced signings and the club can start to climb the leagues once more.

I still have a lot of good friends at the club and it's the first result i look for. It was dissapointing not to be offered a coaching position of some kind after being forced to retire due to my back injury and i would have loved to have worked for the club i joined as a 14 year old schoolboy and served as a first team player for 10 years.

I hope things will look brighter in the coming weeks or it will be another season of gloom and doom.

Jeff

Jeff Thorpe, Cairns, Queensland, Australia

Al's note : If Billy Barr gets the manager's job, there'll be a vacancy for youth coach and it would be nice to think that Thorpey might be offered it.

Thu, 19 Jul 2001 00:22:37 +0100 (BST)

I would like to know who is the "club spokesman" when Knighton Jr and "Cruella de Whittaker" are not around to spout their worn-out jibberish. According to a so called club spokesman, Peter Beardsley doesn't have any managerial experience for the Carlisle job. So what level of experience did Michael Knighton possess when he was "playing" at manager a few seasons back? And outside perhaps an "A"level in economics what football experience and knowledge does "Junior" have to be a director and making decisions for the direction of a "football club"? I can only imagine what football wisdom Ms. Whittaker has-nowt- as she isn't even aware of the Professional Footballers Association evidenced by her catastrophic handling of the four sacked players. What is my point? Well, apart from the first time managerial experiences of John Barnes (Celtic) and Tony Cottee (Barnet) and a few others, hasn't there been a significant number of managers who have had a successful baptism during their first engagement of magerial duty? Remember Bill Shankly (Workington) and Brian Clough (Hartlepool)? What managerial experience did they have when they started with those clubs?! So the argument presented by the "club spokesman" has no substance whatsoever. It is just another piece of calculated information from the club "spin doctors" to ward-off football types from infiltrating the club! I bet the club spokesman was Andrea Whittaker in drag.

Trevor Taylor, Boston, Massachusetts, USA

Al's note : Shankly in fact began his managerial career here at Carlisle. But he made a good rookie manager.

Sun, 15 Jul 2001 19:55:58 +0100 (BST)

So once again the Knighton/Whitaker school for causing dismay has tried to put the blame for things going wrong at our beloved club on the fans themselves. How can a club that has brought in almost £5 million from transfers whilst only reinvesting £10,000, and also remortgaging the ground in what seems to be a very dodgy deal, be so much in debt? Surely to improve the club reinvestment would have been seen as vital. Who else would sell of the best assets for less than their true worth?

The club are in the predicament due to mismanagement by the current directors and this is clearly seen to come down to the one person who put them where the are, Michael Knighton. He hired them so now they should be fired due to turning what was "a nice profitable club" into the laughing stock of the football league. Carlisle United is supposed to be a football club which should mean that players are the biggest assets! So if you want to save money get rid of the two money drains at the top Mark Knighton and Andrea Whitaker. Dont get rid of players then blame the fans.

Where have all these interested parties gone who were supposed to be interested in buying the club? If any still remain interested please do something soon before its too late.

As for a fans boycott, I feel that everyone should go to the first match of the season aganist Luton and show the owners just what they think of the predicament that they have left the club in. Not that I would expect any of them to be present because they obviously don't actually know anything about football in the first place!

Mike Davis, Norwich

Sat, 14 Jul 2001 16:06:10 +0100 (BST)

A message to all the diehard blues fans out there; we desperately need mass protests in the city; down at the club wherever.

Something must be done now to try somehow to make the crazy situation better. We cant just rely on other parties to just go and buy the club'the fans need to put real pressure on the so called chairman and his monkeys. they are bleeding the club dry,they want the good name of carlisle united to destroyed and football league status gone forever.

Come on carlisle fans,we cant let this happen, just imagine saturdays without football. The way things are going it could be alot sooner then we think. never mind our last two seasons close calls,this presant situation is the closest call of all time. please go mr knighton and take your monkeys with you.

from a true blue.

David Airey, Carlisle

Al's note : The fight has started in earnest to save our club. We need as many people on our side as possible.

Sat, 14 Jul 2001 09:29:07 +0100 (BST)

CARLISLE UTD - NATIONWIDE DIVSION THREE 2001 - 2002, CARLISLE UTD - REST IN PEACE - MAY 2002. The future of CUFC as I see it. Brunton Park developed as shopping mall. All we have to say thanks for nowt MR Knighton, Mark Knighton and Mrs Whitaker.

Alan Bainbridge, Berkeley, Gloucs

Thu, 12 Jul 2001 18:42:35 +0100 (BST)

I am currently on business in Oman and as always I am keeping up with Carlisle United FC news via the internet. I am also sat here in total disbelief at the charade which continues to be acted out in the name of a once proud football club. It honestly beggars belief. Like most Carlisle United fans I am so frustrated at the continuing saga of the board, when is Michael Knighton going to get the message, you are not wanted !! It has been said before but it is as true today as it was when it was first muted, Carlisle United have one of the most loyal and fanatical supporter bases in the UK. All it needs is the partnership of an equally dedicated and fanatical board for the club to become the envy of the lower divisions and maybe one day the very top of the football league pyramid. It is clear to me and thousands of others who support Carlisle United FC that without change the end of the club is in sight. On behalf of all football supporters, but in particular those who follow Carlisle United, I appeal to Michael Knighton, swallow your pride, do the honourable thing and release us all from this farce. Maybe you enjoy being the laughing stock of the football world but we do not.

RJ Percival, Ilchester, Somerset

Al's note : If Knighton hasn't got the message by now, I guess he never will. The indisputable fact is that his continued presence, almost satanic like, is damaging the club's credibility and its chances of survival as a league club. It's crazy that this has been allowed to happen. Especially galling was today's news that Swansea City FC, a club whose finances appear remarkably similar to CUFC's has just been sold for £1. That probably gives you an indication of CUFC's true value.

Thu, 12 Jul 2001 14:58:16 +0100 (BST)

Is it worth us taking a more pragmatic look at Mr. Knighton's mentality in running the club as it is currently being run?

There has been a great deal said about his desire to harm the club the fans without any full explanation as to whether these are primary goals or simply symptoms of whatever plan he has. Yes, the club is in free-fall and, seemingly, spiraling towards ruination. But what is he thinking? He is, remember, a businessman (albeit crooked and inept)and I cannot quite believe that he is malicious/ stupid enough to allow a potentially viable and valuable business go to the wall. The talk is that he wants £500,000 for the club (buyer takes on £1,000,000 debt and weekly losses). He patently will not get it. So, does he react by letting it fall to pieces? Is this his intent? Is he stalling to avoid spending a penny until the Delap/ Dobie money is safely "accounted for" before offloading the club for pennies? Is he waiting for a Paul Reid payout? Or a Boertien Bonus?

We fans need to think things through carefully and try to avoid hysteria. We know he is a nine-bob note, but is a fool and an economic terrorist? Does he hate us enough to damage his own pocket? I doubt it. Sit still and wait. Support the boycott.

Alwyn Groves, Southampton

Al's note : There are certain things that can't be argued with. Cutting off the club's money supply damages it irreparably. The question in many people's minds is : Does Michael care? Is he actually that keen to make a lot of money out of the SALE of the club, or just by collecting his share of windfalls etc. It also appears that he is keen to retain a minority shareholding, something which many people would find unacceptable.

Wed, 11 Jul 2001 18:33:37 +0100 (BST)

Who are Andrea Whitaker, Mark Knighton and Steve Barker trying to kid.

They have all been vocal about the effects of a boycott and having to get rid of players now we find that the decision was made in May.

Sorry but obviously THEY have been grossly mis-managing the club and using the effects of a boycott was yet another smoke screen sent up by our beloved clubs directors.

I have been a follower of CUFC since 1977 and even when in the Royal Navy, I travelled from Portsmouth,Prestwick,Faslane and Cornwall to see home games. Last Friday I cancelled my 7 year season ticket because simply I have had enough I will not be back at Brunton Park until there is a change in ownership.

I am not a memeber of CCUIST and I didn't need them to tell me to support a boycott. For me the final straw was the sacking of the 4 players, who the hell is a club supposed to survive with an inept board of 2(both appointed by Michael Knighton)

All I want to know is if Michael Knighton wants to sell the club then why the hell is he still here, has he got skeletons in the closet that a takeover would bring to light and it would be beneficial for him to see the club in receivership.

Ian Winter, Carlisle

Al's note : The boycott is not purely a CCUIST invention, as some seem to think. As you say, fans who have yet to join the trust have been talking about staying away ever since the end of last season. CCUIST were merely responding to what grassroots fans have been telling them.

Wed, 11 Jul 2001 11:28:47 +0100 (BST)

It deeply saddens me as a Carlisle United supporter to see the club in these dire circumstances, why has the club sold Dobie for £150,000 if he's supposedly worth over £2million, why sack so many tallented and experienced players, why do the board want to take CUFC into the conference, what hope is there now for Carlisle United???

James Stringer, Kendal

Al's note : Nobody has yet come up with an adequate explanation for the low price on Dobie. Only a few months ago the club TURNED DOWN an offer of £450,000 for the player. Now they accept a figure three times less - and they need every penny they can get, apparently. Search me.

Wed, 11 Jul 2001 11:21:57 +0100 (BST)

As the situation at Brunton Park goes from bad to worse, how long will it be before the subject of redevelopment crops up again? The problem is, I fear, that it won't be talk of new stands but possibly a whole new use for the ground and not for football. Unless changes happen quickly the future, sadly, is looking very bleak. Would the present "controllers" be happy then?

Alan Green, Salisbury

Al's note : The ground can't be used for anything but football, assuming the club is still a going concern. With 3,500 loyal fans, and a lot more who would return if we started to win again on a regular basis, we will always be a going concern.

Wed, 11 Jul 2001 09:18:53 +0100 (BST)

several years ago i was told that carlisle united did not require supporters of my ilk ie questioning what knighton was doing to my club, the problem was the dealings in selling archdeacon and aspinall.

i said at the time that the megalomaniac was trying to ruin the club. it appears now that my predictions are coming true. the way things are going conference or total bankrupcy and no club.

there have been chances to sell the club but no knighton wants to ruin the club and finnally be able to stick two fingers up at the true supporters of carlisle, and get his own back on the people who have questioned and kept questioning his ability to run a once proud and well recoginised club. unfortunately knighton the supporters are still proud and do whatever to keep this club going. so knighton take heed dont play with the real people of carlise as they have long memories, and dont like the fact that you pretend to play with peoples lives. yes Carlisle united is part of our lives

Eric Barrett, Clipston, Leicestershire

Al's note : There is a feeling around at the moment that the club has been "stolen" from us. Having said that, the one thing to emerge from the crisis is the feelings people have for it. They don't want to let it die. They want it to be successful again.

Tue, 10 Jul 2001 18:13:50 +0100 (BST)

Well, what can i say, i am a loyal supporter of the blues but am at a loss for words when it comes to the fiasco that has become. Now i hear Rory Delap has been sold to Southampton and we are set to get a further windfall, where will this money go?, not towards buying players.....even to make up a starting 11 !!!

What are we to expect at the start of this coming season, will we have 11 players, will we have a manager, will the Knighton curse still hane over the club, somebody must have the answers, come on News & Star, do some digging, lets uncover the facts.

THE TRUTH IS OUT THERE !!

Damien Burns, Carlisle

Al's note : The logic behind the decision to sack these players is not immediately obvious.

Tue, 10 Jul 2001 17:12:33 +0100 (BST)

Last season I drove alone in excess of 15,000 miles watching my beloved Carlisle United and am not alone in doing such mileage,I will be supporting the boycott of home games but fully intend to travel away. How that "Woman" has the nerve to say it is the supporters that have caused the latest shambolic state that the "club" (What Club ?) is in beggars belief. I am one of the many who has not renewed my season ticket and am amazed they have taken £25,000 in season ticket sales.

Peter Thompson, Cambridgeshire

Al's note : That is the difference this season. Previously loyal fans such as you and I have now had enough and are prepared to make the ultimate sacrifice. It should never have come to this.

Tue, 10 Jul 2001 11:42:37 +0100 (BST)

The events at Carlisle United over the last few days beggars belief! As I write this there is still confusion over the future of Ian Atkins (although who can blame him if he leaves the club) and four first team sqaud members have had their contracts terminated. We have a failed consultant, who is obviously still bitter at his treatment by the fans, telling us we are 'idiots' for boycotting the club and Andrea Whittaker claiming the sackings are a direct result of an unofficial boycott and low season ticket sales. Have these people forgotten that the product of Carlisle United is entertainment and that their customers are the supporters of the club? All business's, regardless of their size and the nature of their product MUST invest in that product if they are to keep their customers. This is the one thing that Carlisle United have failed to do over the last four years. While we have seen almost £4 million in revenue from the sale of players only £10,000 has been invested in new players during the same period. Yet the people who are running our club seek to lay the blame for the current situation at the feet of the very people who are their lifeblood. Andrea Whittaker claims to have the best interests of the club at heart and yet she further alienates herself and the Knighton family from the fans by these actions. This can only result in further disillusionment of the fans and, when the season starts, a further reduction in attendances. It is clear now that these people have and are continuing to fail the club and the people of Cumbria. It is time now for a new start. Michael Knighton claims he is desperate to sell his majority share holding in the club, but this has been running for a year now and still no progress. I would suggest to Michael Knighton to sell the club NOW while he still has something to sell. With the farcical situation at the club now it will pretty soon be worthless.

Keith Charters, Kirkbampton, Carlisle

Al's note : I can't see how the club are going to win back the fans after this. It appears they care not a jot about their own customers. If the management of Tesco say spoke about their customers in such a way, they'd be sacked on the spot!

Sun, 8 Jul 2001 20:08:35 +0100 (BST)

I have just looked on Carlisle Uniteds Official Website and it has not been updated since at least March 2001.The last press release in February 2001 was only having a go at the News and Star. No news of Atkins, takeovers or the sacking of players or the sale of Dobie.

Is it that because fans are talking of a boycott they cannot afford to pay someone to update it? That seems to be the excuse for everything now.

Knighton, take a hiking holiday to Mars. For company, take your son and Whittaker.

Kenny Moore, Carlisle

Al's note : It's good to see we can still laugh even though the position at the club has descended to farcical levels. Will Mark Knighton be playing up front for us next season I wonder?

Sun, 8 Jul 2001 14:20:58 +0100 (BST)

HAVING SUPPORTED CARLISLE FOR MANY A YEAR ,TRAVELING THOUSANDS OF MILES EACH SEASON AND SPENDING A FORTUNE ON SEASON TICKETS ,AWAY GAMES ,STRIPS,SCARFS,JUNK FOOD ETC AND MOST OF ALL FUEL,CAN'T THE POWERS AT BE AT CARLISLE UNITED REALISE THE FANS CAN ONLY TAKE SO MUCH BULL S--T . AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED THE CLUB ARE THE ONLY ONES TO BLAME FOR THERE FINACIAL DIFFICULTIES AND NOT THE FANS BY PROPOSING TO BOYCOT THE HOME GAMES OR BY THROWING GOOD MONEY AFTER BAD WHO IN THERE RIGHT MINDS WOULD GIVE MONEY TO PEOPLE LIKE THAT WHO ARE JUST GOING TO WASTE IT ON THE LIKES OF SPAR SHOPS RATHER THAN SPENDING ON PROMISING PLAYERS LIKE MATTY GLENNON AND A FEW OTHERS I COULD MENTION ITS A PURE DISGRACE AND THE SOONER THE CLUB IS TAKEN OVER THE BETTER AND THE QUICKER WE CAN GET RID OF THE KNIGHTONS AND THE WHITTIKERS FROM THE CLUB THE BETTER THE CLUB WILL BE AND MOST DEFINETLY THE SUPPORTERS

Graham Walker, Sandysike, near Carlisle

Al's note : And so say all of us.

Sat, 7 Jul 2001 16:19:58 +0100 (BST)

ANDREA WHITTAKER STATES THAT THE FOUR PLAYERS RELEASED LAST WEEK WERE DONE SO DUE TO LOW SEASON TICKET SALES, WHAT ON GODS EARTH DOES SHE EXPECT? THE FANS HAVE HAD ENOUGH AFTER 3 TERRIBLE SEASONS AND ARE NOT PREPARED TO PAY ANOTHER INFLATION BUSTING RISE ON ADMISSION, A TAKEOVER NEEDS TO BE COMPLETED QUICK OR WE COULD BE DOWN BEFORE CHRISTMAS. A SICKENED BLUE!

Joe Pyle, Carlisle

Al's note : Blaming your customers for the decimation of the squad is not the best form of public relations policy.

Wed, 4 Jul 2001 12:37:27 +0100 (BST)

If 4 million pounds have been collected in transfer fees during the last 4 years -- where has it all gone? When were the balance sheets last produced to the share holders? If United are broke then perhaps someone should stand up and tell us what happened to the money. When are we likely to hear the result of the FA enquiry?

Arthur Harold, Carterton, Oxfordshire

Al's note : Shareholders do not appear to have received any accounts from the club this year. The club did lose £760,000 in season 1999-00, and I would estimate about £300,000 last season after allowing for the Arsenal cup tie and the Delap windfall.

Tue, 3 Jul 2001 18:46:11 +0100 (BST)

I continue to be amazed at the fiasco being played out in Cumbria's fair city. How can it be, I wonder, that the club with such high hopes when I left Cumbria should now be a mockery throughout the whole English footballing community; a blight to be avoided by all players, and now, it seems, supporters too; a bleeding heart to be lamented by all who are greatful of a club in a worse state than their own.

I remember all too well the jubilation the filled the city when the 'man who almost bought the other united' bought our prized club and promised us the Premiership. We didn't believe him, of course, but the first division would have been nice. We were dancing in the streets, on the terraces and even at Wembley Stadium: then it all seemed to sour.

What happened? Okay, we know all too much about what has happened with the footballing and buisness side of the club, but what happened to Knighton? The once-loved-now-hated owner of our beloved club. Where has his passion gone? Where have his hopes gone? Has anyone actually wondered how a man who must has the tenacity of a wolverine to be such a successful businessman can give up after two false starts?

The answer is, Knighton has failed, and he's scared.

It would seem that Knighton is not a wolverine at all but just a whimperring coward, hiding away his fear behind a barrage of scandal, accusations and denials. This truth must be made even greater to confront with the mighty Al Fayed having done the very thing for Fulham that Knighton has failed to do for us.

Admit it Knighton: you failed. Now leave us in peace and our club in better hands than yours. Do you really want the resentment of a whole city, a whole county or possibly the whole footballing comunity on your conscience?

J Andrew Bennett, Valencia, Spain

Al's note : It's clear to all that Knighton's ambition disappeared years ago. He has left us with a club that is going nowhere and is now stuck in a seemingly constant fight for survival. As a business, we are now relying totally on windfalls like those for Rory Delap and Paul Reid.

Sun, 1 Jul 2001 07:28:48 +0100 (BST)

Dear News and Star,

I am a concerned Blues fan living abroad getting not much feedback of United's squad this year! Have they signed any new players yet or is Knighton refusing to get his money out again? It's not just playing with joker players like they did last year or we'll just be fighting relegation again, now there is 2 go down so we'll have no chance. just look what other teams like Wigan and Preston have done with money! its about time we put some pride back into being Cumbrians!!

Paul Ritchie, Sydney, Australia

Al's note : G'day Paul. The good news: It won't be two-up, two-down at least not for another year. The bad news: We haven't (yet) signed any new players.

Sat, 30 Jun 2001 18:49:49 +0100 (BST)

I read with interest the various proposals to 'oust' the current owner and his family and agree fully with the good intent. There is no doubt that this man has destroyed the entire structure of the 'football side' of the club and the arguements about the strength of the 'off field' structure leaves alot to be desired.

Having said that is it not the case that any boycott will only result in the club ending in an even worse state than it already is. You may ask is that possible and clearly the answer is yes, they could go out of the Football League and out of buisness all together because if relegated the chances of a return are nil!

The way forward is to support the team, on the terraces, in the new season and show to any prospective new owners that the supporters of Carlisle United are United behind the team and not the Boardroom Destroyers.

Yes in the short term the Boardroom will gain but in the longer term it will be the supporters who will gain by keeping League Football in the far North West.

Clive Carr, Gateshead

Al's note : It is to be hoped that Michael Knighton is paying heed to your concerns. It's a great pity that fans are having to think about boycotting the club in order to effect change.

Fri, 22 Jun 2001 09:24:17 +0100 (BST)

In respose to letter 20/06/01: Fans can hurt Knighton in the pocket.

To Boycott Brunton Park on Match days would merely make life to easy for the Knighton clan. What we need is sustained pressure both inside the ground and Outside. We could march on matchdays, demonstrating through the streets of carlisle. Then continue the demo inside the ground. Banners, chanting etc, lets make Brunton Park a focal point for our anger with the way the club has been run in recent years. Boycotting Brunton Park will merely make Saturday afternoons more enjoyable for Mark Knighton. 6000 plus can exert a great deal of pressure on someone. Dont be apathetic, march, demonstrate at Half time and lets try and get rid of the Knighton Family once and for all. Save Carlisle United its in our hands

Kevin Stuart, Cargo, Carlisle

Al's note : Although a march would be a powerful symbol of fans' feelings, you'd be hard pressed to get the police to agree to such a demonstration and any trouble would inevitably undermine your cause. A boycott, although a rather more drastic measure, is a lot easier to organise and doesn't involve any aggro.

Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:15:05 +0100 (BST)

I have supported United since 1946. At present I live in Oxfordshire and the problem that United have with the present owner of the club is reflected in the affairs of our local club Witney town. The owner of Witney Town claimed that he was looking for a buyer at £350,000 -- local supporters found a buyer but the club has gone into receivership, withdrawn from the local league and closed after 112 years. I can see nothing to prevent Knighton acting in the same way. Is there nothing the FA can do to stop this man destroying a well supported club?

Arthur Harold, Carterton, Oxfordshire

Al's note : It's not just Knighton who is having a destructive effect on a football club. There are too many of his sort around the game at the moment. This is one of the main reasons why so many groups of fans have formed themselves into supporters' trusts. It will be interesting to see, what if anything, the current FA investigation into the club throws up.

Fri, 15 Jun 2001 14:41:44 +0100 (BST)

I fully support the decision to boycott Brunton Park and all things Carlisle United. It would only take a few members of CCUIST to organise "picket lines" at various points to seriously affect the crowd figures. They could have collecting buckets for fans to donate their admission money. The media attantion would be massive and the Trust fund would also benefit. Enough is enough.

A Loyal Fan Who Has Had Enough

Al's note : The concept of "picket lines" is one I find a little hard to stomach. This should surely be a personal thing if fans want to stay away from games. Nobody wants to intimidate supporters into staying away.